TOPIC: Remanufactured Mercurys

Ran across this on e-bay. They appear to do a nice job.

cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/MERCURY-115-HP-100-REMAN-6-CYL-OUTBOARD-MOTOR-/260691303931?pt=Boat_Parts_Accessories_Gear&hash=item3cb2699dfb

Wow! For $4450 it should be nice!

Frank

Have to be a serious collector, or cheaper than 2010 stuff.. I got
same 1987 model 115 ,with that faceplate at a cycle shop 2 yrs ago with control box. $ 200 . My friend has now , never got my Custom
Craft going, back injury , etc...
......

Well, I'd say, This would be a place to buy a ready made motor for your Fiberglassic. Looks like he does nice work. If you weren't into working on you own motors.
There are fiberglassic guys and there are outboard guys. Plus there are guys who do both.

Very pricey, but when you compare it to the price on a new motor ??? Their ad says EVERYTHING is RE MANUFACTURED, not just "rebuilt". I don't recall reading anything about a warranty from them, but then I'm getting old and feeble minded.

I probably would have DR.Frankenmerc build me a nice tower of power. Cause I know everybody who had him work on there motors were very very happy with the results. He has tons of know-how to boot.

I just rebuilt basically the same engine New pistons, new rings new bearings, and I will tell you it is not cheap to make them new again. It is easy to have 1200$ in 6 new pistons, rings and machine work.

This guy could easily have $2000 in the motor buying it and then all his parts. The time factor is big on a project like this.

I do it cause I love to see the insides of these things and all the little ways Mercury refined them over the years.

But for a guy who wants 115 ponies that work when called apon without the leg work, this is a good route.

I buy 300 dollar motors that turn out to be gems and run them all the time. But thats lucky

Conrad

I agree Conrad, there is way more costs involved then what most people think. Even if you do not need the new pistons and the machine work done, which in these years of motors that would be rare, the costs of the normal parts adds up fast. Then add in the paint work, decals, and about 50-60 hours there is not much room left to make a few bucks!

But it sure is fun!

Darrell

6 new pistons / machine work / say 3 new reed blocks ($300.00 each ) and it really is not worth it for a shop to give the owner a bill for $4500.00 to refurbish one.

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That is why they are available cheap to those who have the parts and the " know how " to make them perform again.

The reed blocks are a critical part of a rebuild, especially in the 6 cyl. The top and bottom ones rarely pass inspection to be re-used.
When the labrynths wear out primarily due to crankshaft 'wobble' the bypassing crankcase pressure can hamper the ability to have good idle quality.
Since they are NLA and rarely come up on eBay in NOS condition I have experimented with re-machining them.
A machinist pal up in Canada took on the task for me and created a set of blocks for me.
He milled out the middle of the blocks and then created an insert with new labrynths to fit in the blocks returning the I.D. of the blocks to 1.245". The inserts were pinned once in place.
This process returned the labrynth-to-crankshaft clearance back to original clearances.
I've heard that the bleed restrictors found in the transfer port area (intake ports) have a significant roll in idle quality too.
I've also heard that they do not.
I lean towards them being part of idle quality and have been replacing missing ones when I assemble.
The original style restrictors leave some to be desired and although I haven't done it yet, I believe the Professor's way of correcting their failure rate is the best I've seen suggested.
That is to tap out the holes just deep enough to house an insert and then thread in an insert with the proper sized hole drilled to be consistent with the hole size in the original plastic inserts.
Professor,...Would you please re-post the tap size and related insert size you use please.
And do you use brass or steel inserts?
Are these inserts installed with an allen wrench?,..Or?
And what size hole do you drill in the inserts?
Thom
hum-m-m-m??? tried to post pictures of the reed block repair, but a link prints rather than a picture??? jpeg format, 70KB?? Anybody know why??

I use 8-32 stainless setscrews

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Just deep enough so they are recessed.

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Installed with allen wrench.

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I drill a 0.035 " hole in them, on a lathe using a fixture.

Professor, is there any chance of purchasing a set of 6 of the setscrews with the proper size drilled hole for a 1974 Mercury 115 HP? Tryed everything to get rid of a hesitation problem under acceleration, and the bleed system may be the next thing to look at.
If you can get through the hesitation/fuel starvation problem, it does not come back again that day.

dpanky,
That sounds more like too lean of a set on the idle jets or an improperly sycronized timing to carburetor linkage.
More details are available if you're interested.
Thom

The motor only needs 5 bleed inserts.

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These set screws are installed when the motor is all apart.

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Special effort would have to be used to keep metal chips from going to the piston below.

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Use a toothpick to see if the plastic inserts are missing and install factory originals if they are.

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Agreed , hesitation and stalling is due to lean set-up on the carburetors.

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There is much more to getting one of these motor to run right than a magic fix.

Thanks for the advice. The motor has been gone through by three good longtime Mercury outboard motor mechanics.

I have great confidence in the third mechanics work on the carb settings and link/sync as he has been racing boats for 25 years including Merc 6 in-lines.The latest mechanical work was done in Minnesota in November and was driveway tested but the cold weather prevented lake or river testing. Will test in the spring under load for fine tuning.

The motor runs great once the hesitation problem is overcome and the motor looks like new inside and out. Hate to give up on it.

Agreed your motor " looks very good "

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I still say you need to fine tune low speed needles / jets.

I used what we in the UK call grub-screws for my transfer port restrictors, I think we are talking the same thing, the sort of thing you would use to lock a ring or a pulley to a shaft using an Allen key to tighten it. We are mostly metric here so I got some 4mm stainless ones & drilled (with difficulty) them to 0.035" as the Professor suggests. My '84 115 had all 5 of the plastic restrictors missing when I stripped it down. I would not idle at all, not surprising when you have a 3+mm hole from one cyl. crankcase to another. I was pleased when I found this as it must, at least in part, explain the poor idle. The reed blocks are not perfect but not that bad & I am changing them anyway from 10/8's to 10/10's.

It surprises me that no one has developed a split back-to-back metal clad seal arrangement to fit in the reed blocks in place of the labyrinth seals. I remember some years ago fitting some of these split seals in some application or other where you couldn't get to the end of the shaft as such to slide a normal MCS over it, as you would with the top & bottom seals for example. With these in place you would have 100% seal. Or has it been tried & proved to be a disaster??

I had a major problems with it last year with stumbling/hesitation when accelerating, it was like it ever since I owned it (Jan '09). I overhauled the carbs, disabled the back-drag system (blocked the pipe) & re-set the sync & timing. It was fine this year - apart from the idle issue.

Grubb screw

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set screw is the same thing.

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Stainless is easy to drill.

www.plasticnutsandbolts.com/screwsz.html

So are nylon set screws, and if they are ingested, cause no harm. The restrictors are necessary. Thom, I thought you had solved that poor idle problem??

I assume you are already aware, but the final idle adjustment can't be made while running on the muffs.
The boat needs to be in the lake, with the lake's water level typically running at idle at at least half way up the DSH (drive shaft housing) to create the relative back pressure on the exhaust when doing the final adjustments.
Once the in Neutral idle RPMs are correct (550-700) and a crisp idle is obtained under these circumstances,...It is not uncommon to discover that you will need to richen (open - counter-clockwise) all three idle jets identically as much as 1.5 more turns to eliminate the off idle stall when attaempting to throttle up.
This richening process is completed 1/8th of a turn to all three idles jets per attempt to throttle up, continuing at 1/8th turn per attempt until the off idle stall is eliminated.
Why must the idle be richened when you had such a nice crisp idle at a much leaner setting?,..Because the richer mix allows excess fuel mix to be in the crankcase laying around - too 'heavy' to be sucked into the ccombustion chambers while the butterflies are closed at idle - just 'waiting' for the carburetor butterflies to jump open - so that the combustion chambers receive not only the prompt intake of air, but also this 'excess' fuel mix - not just air (which causes the bog or stall condition) - to the awaiting pistons, which react with instant performance.
The difference between this type of carburetor and an old school automotive carburetor is simply this: The automotive carburetors had accelerator pumps to 'inject' an extra shot of gas to make the big gulp of air intake a proper mix when the butterflies are dropped open to accelerate - these Merc carbs do NOT have an accelerator pump and consequently are dependant on this extra idle fuel mix presence in the crankcase to have a good acceleration.

I just bought new plastic restrictors and peened over the hole so they did not come out, I doubt they will ever come out again unless a severe overheating problem occurs.

I had the motor mostly back together and did not want shaving etc around an open motor.

I also have a weird feeling about putting apiece of steel in there that could possibly come loose and ruin a motor. If a plastic one can come loose then a steel one could too, threded or not.

I have a 650 that had the reed stop locator pin come out and destroyed the cyl wall pison etc...making the motor useless.

The little plastic should go in and out without problem if lost.

Conrad

"Thom, I thought you had solved that poor idle problem??"
Huh???
My beasts idle fine? Did I miss sumthin'???

And,..I totally agree with considering threaded nylon allen head inserts over stainless steel.
Someone mentioned that earlier today on a different forum & think it is a very good idea.
Professor - what are your thoughts on this?
Thom

There are just too many people who say ----" that can not be done "

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Those stainless set screws will never come out.

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Just like the rod bolts on a high revving newer Mercury or older OMC that do not have lockwashers on them.

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I am glad nobody feels they need to put lockwashers on them to improve them.

6 new pistons / machine work / say 3 new reed blocks ($300.00 each ) and it really is not worth it for a shop to give the owner a bill for $4500.00 to refurbish one.

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That is why they are available cheap to those who have the parts and the " know how " to make them perform again.

Agreed Professor, but for the guy who cannot rebuild one him/herself and wants one I dont think this guy is over pricing them by too much. Id never buy one, cause I do the leg work myself, but not all can do so. And I am a legendary titewad

There are just too many people who say ----" that can not be done "

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Those stainless set screws will never come out.

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Just like the rod bolts on a high revving newer Mercury or older OMC that do not have lockwashers on them.

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I am glad nobody feels they need to put lockwashers on them to improve them.

Who says you cannot do this? I think you should and its great way of doing things. I just mentioned that I dont feel comfortable putting steel in where it can get in trouble. Your right it has near ZERO chance of coming loose, but I just fixed mine for 5 bucks with factory bleed restrictors in 5 minutes, with no metal shavings and Im pretty sure they will never come out and if they do, no biggy, pull a transfer port and put one back in, no major rebuild involved.

Many ways to peel a banana.

PS. I think mine got lost when I was blowing the block out with high pressure air after cleaning it up after the hone job!

Most of the motors I work on have missing bleed restricters.

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They come out easily.

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Somebody said the steel ones might fall out and that is " nonsense "

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They will NEVER come out when properly installed.

In the few 99 blocks Ive torn apart there is one thing ive noticed. The bleed holes are not peened over very well to hold the plastic restrictor in.

When I put new ones in I work it over a bit more than factory to reduce the hole size. Im pretty sure Ill never loose one again this way.

I like your idea! I just feel safer with plastic in there. Be it a threded plastic screw or the factory jobby-do
Thanks
Conrad

If I has thought about plastic grub screws I would have used them for a belt & braces fix but I didn't think about them at the time & bought stainless as suggested on here. I can't see how they can come out as some are saying here as the thread in the hole only goes down part way, so the grub screw can't walk downwards & they are held in place with Locktite plus the hole is peened over on top of the grub screw. I confess I wouldn't feel comfortable about using the original design as my motor shows no obvious signs of an overheat yet all 5 were missing. Plus the hole is parallel all the way down so even if you peen the top over what is to stop it going downwards?

Geoff